How should we measure progress - by what we produce and consume, or by how people and nature are doing? Dr. Julia Kim, a physician and systems thinker, discusses Bhutan’s Gross National Happiness (GNH) as an alternative to GDP, and shows how inner development - including her contemplative and spiritual practice - provides the human foundations for translating that vision into policy, institutions, and everyday life.
Julia Kim began her career in clinical medicine before moving into health policy and international development with the UN and other agencies. She later served as Program Director at the Gross National Happiness Centre, Bhutan, and is a member of the Wellbeing Economy Alliance and an Executive Committee Member of the Club of Rome.
In this conversation:
Julia’s path from medicine to systems work—and how contemplative practice and spirituality inform her leadership
What Gross National Happiness measures and how it reframes policy choices
Practical ways NGOs can create low-barrier spaces for reflection and values-aligned action
Real-world effects of GNH (e.g. community norms around forest conservation) and the tensions of a GDP-centric world
How other Wellbeing Economy approaches are taking shape in the world
Resources:
Season 5 leads into the IDG Summit 2025 in Stockholm, where the Inner Green Deal curates a full-day track. Use code “MeSummit2025” for 15% off in-person and 50% off digital tickets. With thanks to the Robert Ho Family Foundation for their support.
Our podcast is hosted and produced by Tamsin Walker. Executive producer is IGD co-founder Jeroen Janss. For more information, visit innergreendeal.com or write to info@innergreendeal.com.
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